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  #281  
Old 1st December 2013, 09:15 PM
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EELS EELS is offline
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Hmm, now I'm really confused. Much though I'd love to believe this is 28 pages of misinterpretation, I have to ask, if no change, then what was the point of the proposal? Plus the phrase about the bulk of the bag being 'in front of the shooter' (as oppose to under the ankle shin as at present) really doesn't go to back up this 'redraft of the status quo' version of events.
Once again I would bring it back to enforcing the rules we have - in doing this each example would help clarify the stance that the BFTA are trying to get us all to shoot.

Quick update on the 'Say NO to slinging out the sling campaign' as yet no word has reached me on how a ban benefits our sport etc but discussion at ourSEFTA regional winter league today reflected concern that the only stated reason anyone can find was the proposal itself, which stated that it should not be used as it '...steady's the aim..' (surely an oxymoron in any target shooting sport!?) if we go down this road then a ban on gloves, shooting jackets, butt-hooks, custom stocks etc is sure to follow, so cancel all Xmas presents t yourselves now!!
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  #282  
Old 1st December 2013, 09:26 PM
JonathanN JonathanN is offline
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Hi
Just for the record I wasnít at the meeting, I just read the draft minutes and as far as I can tell from reading them the only change to the rule is if you put the seat under your knee then most of it has to be in front, not sure what the intension of this change was, I have looked through the agenda (on the BFTA site) and I canít see any explanation of what the change is actually trying to fix so I can only go on what the minutes say
As for interpreting rules however you want; is the glass half full or half empty? Depends who you ask, without clear definition all you are left with is interpretation.
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  #283  
Old 1st December 2013, 09:31 PM
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Hi Dan,

Please don't shoot the messenger.

from the definition of kneeling:

The leading hand will support the gun and, forward of the wrist should itself be unsupported

I think the opposition is because the sling could support the wrist.

The proposal has been raised many times by the FFTA and this is the first time it was supported.

Shaun
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  #284  
Old 1st December 2013, 09:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dave croucher View Post
Excellent news !just follow the letter of the rules and carry on as normal then
Can we now please define the knee,ankle shin and any other related body parts like the wrist had to be defined
Why not remove the bag all together problem solved,no bag no chance of using it illegally.
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  #285  
Old 1st December 2013, 10:00 PM
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If we remove the rifles , we remove the risk of an illegal gun .??? HOLLY
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  #286  
Old 1st December 2013, 10:10 PM
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well said ALEXs . HOLLY
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  #287  
Old 1st December 2013, 10:16 PM
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If we remove the rifles , we remove the risk of an illegal gun .??? HOLLY
What!!!! I thought we were talking about kneelers.
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  #288  
Old 1st December 2013, 10:36 PM
neilL neilL is offline
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Probably said many pages ago but just to say again.

The cttee made it clear that they did not want any form of ankle roll (it was discussed). Bags are just to keep the knee clean and not provide support. One motion was withdrawn which mentioned them and nobody proposed any amendments to the motion which was voted through. The intent of the cttee was clear - 3 points of contact, no ankle supports, bag or mat just to keep the knee clean but not required. I.e. a simple definition which is easier to enforce.

The 2014 Main Shoot Rules will combine existing rules and the changes made at the AGM and will be discussed and clarified at the January EGM. So fine tuning will be done there.

Positionals are supposed to be more difficult than the freestyle (sitting) position. Someone effectively sitting whilst "kneeling" is just abusing all those who kneel correctly. There are many who have problems with knee joints and ankle problems and to help them the rule was brought in for 2013 that kneelers may be taken standing (but both targets, not mix and match).

Nobody should expect kneeling for FT targets to be comfortable, if you needed extra height while hunting then of course additional padding and support should be used. It is an artificial position which requires balance and composure for a short time whilst taking the shot not for the entire 2minutes for the lane.

I would suggest that either kneeling is made clear cut and more difficult than sitting or we simply do away with kneeling altogether and have more standers or even worse - require prone (no slings, no support) which would be unpopular with many others.

I am glad there is lots of discussion but it should be directed at the regional representatives and converted in to well constructed motions for the next meeting.
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  #289  
Old 1st December 2013, 11:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by neilL View Post
Probably said many pages ago but just to say again.

The cttee made it clear that they did not want any form of ankle roll (it was discussed). Bags are just to keep the knee clean and not provide support. One motion was withdrawn which mentioned them and nobody proposed any amendments to the motion which was voted through. The intent of the cttee was clear - 3 points of contact, no ankle supports, bag or mat just to keep the knee clean but not required. I.e. a simple definition which is easier to enforce.

The 2014 Main Shoot Rules will combine existing rules and the changes made at the AGM and will be discussed and clarified at the January EGM. So fine tuning will be done there.

Positionals are supposed to be more difficult than the freestyle (sitting) position. Someone effectively sitting whilst "kneeling" is just abusing all those who kneel correctly. There are many who have problems with knee joints and ankle problems and to help them the rule was brought in for 2013 that kneelers may be taken standing (but both targets, not mix and match).

Nobody should expect kneeling for FT targets to be comfortable, if you needed extra height while hunting then of course additional padding and support should be used. It is an artificial position which requires balance and composure for a short time whilst taking the shot not for the entire 2minutes for the lane.

I would suggest that either kneeling is made clear cut and more difficult than sitting or we simply do away with kneeling altogether and have more standers or even worse - require prone (no slings, no support) which would be unpopular with many others.

I am glad there is lots of discussion but it should be directed at the regional representatives and converted in to well constructed motions for the next meeting.
Neil
Was it also said that the kneelers should be over, where practical level ground and not up in trees or down in vallys
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  #290  
Old 1st December 2013, 11:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by buzz View Post
Neil
Was it also said that the kneelers should be over, where practical level ground and not up in trees or down in vallys
That is again something that will have to be addressed in the Shoot Rules. Target placement can obviously be a serious issue for forced positionals and experienced course setters will be aware (in much the same way as for left-handed vs. right-handed shooters) when planning lanes. The gate will have to be flat within reason. Having an experienced shooter inspect the course ahead of the start would be a sensible approach?
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