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Old 9th January 2016, 11:40 AM
skires skires is offline
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 950

It amazes me how people keep quoting the rules.

The rules are there in black and white ... and in photos ... for all to see.

The problem isn't the rules. The problem isn't bags. It's the fact that shooters will push the rules to their limit and beyond and marshalls/partners won't enforce the rules. When that happens the rules are pointless. That's where the sport's been re kneeling for a long time.

So if people won't abide by the rules or enforce them then you see what else can be done. In this case ( at least atm the World situation ) that's meant getting rid of bags. If some people abuse the bags and a lot of other people won't enforce rules re bags ... then get rid of the bags.

The only people to blame for that happening are those that abuse the use of bags and those that won't enforce the rules.

Not everyone is being made to suffer. Shooters will be able to use a roll. Testing to date ( by Bri ) has shown that the roll is just as good as a bag, eliminates the possibility of cheating and controversy, and hasn't cost him any points on kneelers.

FFS it's not difficult ... learn to shoot kneelers without a bag. At the moment, as I understand it, no reduced kills are allowed on kneelers and the max distance is 45 yards. It's not impossible shooting to hit kneelers within those guidelines from a very traditional stance with no bag.

As I've said the next thing will be the front arm, wrist, hamster thing. To be honest that's almost pointless IMO. No one shoots with a floppy wrist. The entire fore arm is allowed to be rested along the thigh with the elbow right back. Just try this at home ... if you lock the wrist ... try pushing down on that front hand with the wrist locked. That hand is solid. That hand and forearm almost become one unit. It will take whatever weight any target rifle/scope can throw at it. So it's basically no difference if you have that wrist on the knee, just forward of the knee or back from the knee with the back of the hand resting on the thigh. I doubt it's much difference if you allow the front hand to cup the knee as in sitters. Try it. I've tried it. Made no difference to me. The stability issues are trying to keep the lower leg and knee stable ( can be improved by turning foot in ) and keeping the upper right quadrant stable ( no support for right elbow ).

Traditionally the elbow is close to the knee which gives a more upright, straighter back poistion. I prefer that as I can breath better and there is less strain on stiff back muscles. In this more traditional stance a sling is an advantage as the upper and lower arms give more of a 'V' and the sling helps lock and support that 'V' and takes the weight of the rig rather than the bicep having to do that. A sling is of little use with the fore arm rested along the thigh. The forearm along thigh means there is no wobble in the lower arm but it's still the knee/lower leg that will move and give wobble.

If you do some practising you will hit kneelers without worrying too much about trying to get that wrist an inch further back or getting extra support from a bag. So IMO all the fuss is b0ll0x anyway. Those that can shoot kneelers will hit kneelers ... those that can't ... won't.

Last edited by skires; 9th January 2016 at 01:38 PM.
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